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Net Talk • Active Rock Needs to Change it’s direction
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Active Rock Needs to Change it’s direction

Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 2:48 am
by revevilunion51
Hey, I am a man who loves hard rock and metal music on the radio. But when I mean hard rock and metal, I’m referring to genres that are more extreme and dangerous, like Djent, Metallic Hardcore, Stoner Rock, Progressive Metal, Experimental Metal, Math Rock, Mathcore, Art Rock, Post-Rock, and the Revival genres of 70s-based Glam Rock, Grunge, and Blues Rock, as well as a new genre entitled Thread Rock, which is the genre to describe blues, Grunge, and Indie rock influenced bands like Citizen Zero and The Wans.

And I’m so sick and tired of hearing the same butt rock music whether it’s from Shinedown or any other butt rock band on this planet I don’t want to hear it anymore. I’m sick of hearing bands like Korn, Rob Zombie, Marilyn Manson, Metallica, Avenged Sevenfold, Halestorm, or any other throwback pop punk or mallcore of bands like Korn, Limp Bizkit, Green Day, and Blink-182, it just bothers my brain.

I’m 23 years old but, when I introduced young kids who wanna hear what rock radio is about, I want them to get into bands like Prong, Dead Letter Circus, Karnivool, Skindred, Dredg, Twelve Foot Ninja, The Dillinger Escape Plan, Deafheaven, Helmet, Ill Niño, Dinosaur Pile-Up, Pendulum, Dope, Fear Factory, To Whom it May, Monster Magnet, Code Orange, Being as an Ocean, The Sword, These are the artist that I call pure rock radio.

And it doesn't have to be commercial friendly rock music, and no band has to water down their highly complex sound and make general simplification for the height of radio airplay, when a band is a band, they get played on rock radio, That’s it.

I want to see this dream come true by mid 2018, alright?

Re: Active Rock Needs to Change it’s direction

Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 6:13 pm
by hrdj3c
And I'm pretty much on the opposite end of the spectrum. Active rock radio needs to live up to the moniker & stop trying to be alternative or anything else.

There's a fairly broad range of sub-genres that can fit into the Active Rock branding but most of the ones you name do not, can not, and should not ... any more than the alternacrap pseudo-rock that's strangling the format in recent months.

Re: Active Rock Needs to Change it’s direction

Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:53 pm
by revevilunion51
But Post-grunge is long gone dead in the Water. Nu Metal has made a slight comeback with bands like Dangerkids, Islander, From Ashes to New, Sylar, and Fire From the Gods. But now rock fans have moved on from those 2000s artists. They want to hear new rock music like Progressive Metal, Industrial Metal, and Experimental Rock, that what they want to listen to on the radio. They also want to hear some Math Rock baked in the mix, as well as a little bit of Art Rock, that's what they want today. They also want some Djent and plenty of Hardcore Punk-influenced Metalcore. Fans want to hear what they want on the radio. Please?

Re: Active Rock Needs to Change it’s direction

Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 10:51 am
by ron connor
Perhaps you could have a specialty show.

Re: Active Rock Needs to Change it’s direction

Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 8:29 pm
by robctas
Radio works by appealing to the broad base. If that core audience is exposed to material too challenging, cume drops off. (Hence specialist shows of a night). As a program director, you always watch the waves hoping your music philosophy is focused.
Breaking new bands & music too quickly will burn the material when the rest of the country finally catches up. Unfamilarity & playing "non safe" tracks spells disaster no matter how good the tracks are. Remember, your station is a business & it's your job on the line. Would you risk losing cume & TSL just becasue you dig the Gojira track? As much as I'd love to put them in an "A", I'd be on the street in a few books time.

In my opinion, radio does need to change & I'd love to hear a station that mixes the current tracks with the ones in the original message. In this technological age, radio needs to be a breaker to keep up with what's happening on Spotify or Facebook.

Music selection on a station is a's an example of how it works:

"Over play" is a term that is subjective. Radio stations typically program their music for their P1 audience. P1 is defined as a group of listeners who listen to that station more than any other station in the market. After looking at a stations' P1 weekly audience, and AQH (Average Quarter Hour listenership), a station will set spin counts based on how many times a week they would like their P1 audience to hear each song. Some programmers use the Optimum Effective Scheduling (OES) which is a calculation to determine required frequency for a message (or song).


A radio station has a weekly P1 audience of 30,000 listeners. The P1 AQH of the station is 2,500.

The OES calculation of P1 cume / P1 AQH X 3.29 = 39.48. This is the number of times a message (or song) needs to air for all of these P1s to hear it 3 times. So, if a station wants its P1 audience to hear it's "Power Songs" (most played) once a day, they would take 39.48, divide it by 3, and mutiply that by 7 (days in a week). They would play the song 92 times per week for their P1 audience to hear the song once per day.

Where you might run into the "over playing" of songs is that there might be 2 or 3 or more stations in one market all trying to appeal to the same audience with a lot of the same music, so as you bounce around the dial, you're likely to be bombarded by those songs; also known as hits.

Re: Active Rock Needs to Change it’s direction

Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 12:42 am
by hrdj3c
But go too broad and you drive down TSL and eventually diminish your P1s. Rock radio seems determined to create as many tuneout moments as possible these days, in what appears to be a hellbent effort to chase cume without regard to anything else.

As for the overplay issue, not sure how many markets have even a second rock station playing currents at this point, much less a third. That's an issue for Country and CHR, not nearly so much so for (current) Rock.

Re: Active Rock Needs to Change it’s direction

Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:21 pm
by parocks
If I like rock, but I don't work in a warehouse, obviously I'm not going to be listening to active rock radio these days.

Over the course of what I'd guess was 20 years maybe, well, I'm not an expert on exactly when "Active Rock" became a format. I'm guessing that prior to "Alternative Rock" which came in around Nirvana, let's say 1992, there was just Rock. After Rock, and Alternative Rock, I'm guessing Active Rock, Mainstream Rock is the stations that play pre Nirvana rock, and AAA which, today, 2017, looks like indie rock. Korn was Active Rock 20 years ago, after the good years of Alternative Rock.

I'm guessing over the last 20 years, Active Rock PDs or MDs decided that the #1 priority was to keep their core audience happy, as if that core audience was going to start doing something other than listen to Active Rock. The internet has been around about 20 years now, and people who like a variety of kickass rock but don't work in warehouses, and are not generally sad and poor, have completely abandoned the Active Rock format if not radio entirely. Some folks just have a knack for using things like ipods and smartphones, and others don't. The ones that don't are still there with their beloved Active Rock stations. Way back in the day, 10 years before Nirvana, I was passionate about my rock station and I will say, as a young high school student, I didn't like it one bit when my rock station would play "not rock". I suspect that pressure to not play not rock is strong. But the downside is that middle class and above is just gone. And when Active Rock stations are only playing music that warehouse workers and 9th graders like, well, it means that Top 40 is playing no rock, because the kind of stuff that warehouse workers and 9th graders like does not overlap with what normal people like.

Back in the old days it wasn't quite as easy to skip radio. Some would've predicted that radio would've gone away over the last 15 years, and it clearly hasn't. What has happened is that radio has really increased the overall level of suck in the last 15 years, and it's still there. I'd love to say that if Active Rock started playing awesome, that the people who left will come back but, I'm not sure that's going to happen. Would be nice to have MTV again. 15 years ago MTV played QOTSA No One Knows over and over, and radio wasn't having it, until they finally got the message, played it, found that people liked it, and it ended up being a huge hit.

Looking at the rock charts, the summer of 2017 really isn't all that bad. There's nothing as bad as Puddle of Mudd She Hates Me on there. (Who except total losers could identify with that? When did Active Rock programmers say "forget normal people listening to our station, we're gonna let all those people leave, and we're going to focus entirely on making our loser audience happy". And the rock stars themselves, the Active Rock ones, they can't like their fans, they appreciate getting rich from their consumption of their music, but would not typically voluntarily hang with them. Active Rock fans are pretty sad.)

Top 40 is awful, it needs to have much more rock on it, because, even if Active Rock fans are losers largely, they do spend money on concert tickets. Who is going to be going to concerts in 10, 20, 30 years. Not rock does not make money on concerts, rock does, and if you take a rock band, give them a few top 40 hits, they'll be able to make money for everybody until they're 70 years old. Top 40 is 100 different versions of the Osmonds, who, not surprisingly, have not been touring constantly for 50 years. Styx and REO Speedwagon and Kansas are still touring, even though they never had the massive success of the The Osmonds. Active Rock needs to have more Alternative Rock, AAA needs more Alternative, and Alternative needs more AAA, and Top 40 needs more Rock - a lot more rock.

The Rock charts have bands that tour and make money. The Top 40 charts don't. The number of listens a Top 40 song gets is staggering. You'd think that all those listens would drive people to shows. Doesn't happen for that pop crap. But you give rock bands spins on top 40, there will still be big concerts in the future.

Re: Active Rock Needs to Change it’s direction

Posted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 6:02 am
by viktorwilt
Just had to pipe in, my station is based in one of the most conservative markets in the country, and we are having no trouble dominating with not only men, but also women, playing more really heavy material in all dayparts than almost any other active rock station in the country. We've maintained at least a top 3 share in all key sales demos for the last 3 years. I guarantee that playing it safe is not what is going to move active rock forward, just take a look at the last decade of the format.

Re: Active Rock Needs to Change it’s direction

Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 8:31 pm
by tristan2330
Sorry about bumping this thread but I completely agree I think it's time to start putting newer music on rotation more especially on the active side I feel like what rock needs right now is a new audience and I know there's a market for this I think all of us know that but again this is coming from someone who has neve been in the radio industry so what do I know xx